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PANZalt
PANZalt
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 9:45 AM
oh please, its always finewhen satan starts three new threads about literally bullshit.

i have a better question for you.

why do you hang out with a bunch of abusive losers who suck down one good tribe of another into trollshit?

And thus, whats your real agenda other than silencing me? as usual?

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PANZalt
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 9:47 AM
n order to have it, you have to define it. but rather than define it so that we can then work to obtain it, lets talk about what it isn't.

Free speech is not a pack of TROLLS and their ALTS determining that the geeks can't have a conversation by always trolling them down, trashing their threads, hijacking threads, being abusive, using slander and personal defamation, manipulation and headgames, and everything else to shut you or anybody that might have thought of talking to you up or out.

Free speech is not the same 25 personalities forming a troll clique and then systematically destroying/ consuming one tribe after another
and reveling the glory of their evil super powers.

Free speech is not a brainstorm tribe where bothering to post much beyond a one liner idea puts you in the firing gallery,

and free speech is not an obvious patent sociopath beating people up psychologically who runs how conveniently the management/user interface aspect of tribe.

Free speech is not a cult of asshats, keeping everybody else from communicating, nor is it a cult of control freaks, keeping everybody else
from communicating.

To hear the TROLLZ tell it, free speech means that they should by definition get to say whatever they want and thats that.

They should be able to libel, stalk, harass, defame, abuse, use abusive language, mock, and use logical fallacies and propaganda
to beat you down; not with sense, nor reason, nor as shatter would have us believe with his utterly shallow and insipid imitation of
"compassion."

But with mere noise, nonsense, and mockery.

Thats the troll idea. and most social networks and most twentieth century institutions have bought this, hook line and sinker.

They figure anything else is either too governmental or too complicated, and nobody really knows how to represent a rules based system
that would protect real free speech, let alone implement one in a program, .... so nobody bothers.

Erstwhile, civilization goes to hell in a handbasket as does tribe and most everything else because geeks of the true variety are outnumbered 100 to one by evil bastards, and 1000 to one by pack psychology sleepwalkers.

Pearls and swine, pearls and swine, flushing it all down as we go and its all trod under and gone....
the conversations we pretended to have, while trollz spewed the place with the shit guaranteed to cover over and thus functionally erase any gems.

What then is free speech? free speech is the simple proposition that people should be able to say what they want; AS WELL AS HAVE THE KIND OF CONVERSATION THEY ARE LOOKING FOR. Otherwise, all any of you are doing is going and talking to an empty forest,
and the most of the lot of you thus wouldn't pass a good turing test.

Free speech is not me trying to talk about things and then people attacking me for trying to talk. it is not about shatters egotism or his utter
ignorance or his headgame vampire parasite head trip.

It is not Mr M freaking out and having a cow on my thread and then later admitting that he was there simply to silence me and anybody else
i might try to talk with.

It is not skooter, who, tho his intentions are much better, lives in that environment and who thus has become a bit too gun happy,
spritzing you with bullets that make no sense.

Free speech is when the geeks can have their geek conversations and the trolls can have their conversations.
Not when the trolls can pre-empt any geek conversation, and not when geeks pre-emptively demand that trollz always behave.
To hear the trollz tell it society is in mortal danger from the geeks imposing some sort of fascistic moderation scheme.
This is a total reversal and doublethink and projection. The truth is that these people are actively engaged in social warfare
for ego purposes, and they are thus social parasites who want an easy slaughter of fresh innocents.

The truth is that its the geeks who for the love of god cannot find one damn good intellectual conversation on all of tribe...

or for that matter, one good intellectual.

Free speech is not catering to trollz and letting them drive anybody else away, and it is not listening to the idea of free speech contorted into
a weapon against itself and believing in that as a dogmatic delusion.

Free speech is for the most part nowhere to be found in your civilization. everybody talks but nobody listens. Most people don;t have anything worth listening too anyways, and it forms a circular habit. As parrot chatter affirming the existence of ego and social identity,
thats great. but tribe has a 99th percentile tribe thats obviously been infiltrated by the same old crew of tribe trolls all with IQs under 120.

Its got a tou watchdog tribe that is now renamed tou corndog. I'm sure thats a comic relief.

Everywhere you look on tribe its the same thing. every major conversation space on tribe is shit because there is so little moderation and
so few people left with any intelligence.

One only has to look around a lot more to see interesting differences. Go to some chat zone site where your only allowed a one sentence contribution at once. stay on it for three days straight and then come back and tell me it has any meaning compared to a full conversation
with things like paragraphs.

It works great for children, the socially inept, or people with IQs under 90. For the rest of us, theres too little bandwidth.

TROLLZ and anti free speech are the same thing. its bandwidth control, and it drives everything stupid. This suits trolls fine because the reason why they are the way they are in the first place is that they are only able to think in terms of competition with a population that they
more or less consciously or subconsciously know is composed of their intellectual superiors. All TROLLZ are overcompensators for
their lack of social skills and their lack of intelligence.

And tribe buys it. And tribe expects anybody other than TROLLZ and sheeple to stick around.
"You are free to make your own tribe."?
And do what with it exactly?
Spend thousands of hours competing with troll tribes to lure sheeple back to my tribe?

Participate myself in the scam of it all and actually go find intellectuals to bring as fresh meat to TRIBES
canned troll food factory?
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PANZalt
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 9:48 AM
so why are you only against free speech when i'm the one talking?
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Vair...
VairoChana:
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 10:48 AM
are you actually talking or manifesting a surging tide of existential discontent within yourself, culminating in some unexpurgated tidal wave of blah on the internet that really only ultimately reflects the same things you are railing against?
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PANZalt
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 11:18 AM
yes.
:)
-----------

are you actually talking
---------
yes, i am actually talking. events of recent have made me reanalyze my relationship with tribe and all i find is disease and wasted
time.
I think theres a point to be made there... technically in most respects tribe lost me as a user a long time ago.
-------------



or manifesting a surging tide of existential discontent within yourself,
-------------
yes, thats there fer sure. i keep coming back to this tribe and trying to work things out with TRIBE and etc...
and what do i get for it? a lot and a lot of thank yous from people who are literally too scared shitless to come in here and post.

and shit from the same old people who make those people too shitless to come in here and post.
-------------



culminating in some unexpurgated tidal wave of blah on the internet that really only ultimately reflects the same things you are railing against?
------------

Reality is funny like that. to carry communication across when all else fails, sometimes joining them to beat them is the only method thats
got a chance.

I find the whole thing disasterously distasteful and i am sure anybody else probably does 2.

But facts are facts, and so we arrive back at square one.

TRIBE is one of the internets worst trollahattens, and a primary reason why is that the old staff were trolls, these people didn't and now don't have much for communication skills, and blaming the victims and denying culpability is just that easy, whereas talking about or resolving the problems is just that hard.

TRibe nearly fell down the last time because the staff broke into three warring parties. And then you have pinkus VS darren.

You'd think we cold learn the lesson without repeating history.

Just because tribe CAN let anything go doesn't mean it should, and abusers and head gamers should be dealt with fairly
by dealing with the shit they raise - not deleting profiles.

Having a PET TROLL in the management -user liason position aka Shatter does what to the system?

in auto inserts abuse and troll shit as the communication style into all of the tribe tribes, which then sends the signal all through tribe
of how low the standards really are.

I shouldn't need to point out that this guy is a chronic habitual liar, that he exists in this room primarily to get his ego kicks off shooting
people down(and making sure all anti troll measures are defeated.) And that hes said things which would technically make him and tribe suitable for libel... almost on a daily basis.

Yeah, i think we should talk about it rather than sweep it under the carpet, and on top of that, if tribe can't face this problem here and now,
then it never will, and any promises it may have made to me become moot as carrots attached to fairy tales.


Either it matters to TRIBE, or it doesn't. If it DOES, then lets deal with it rather than pretending its not an issue so we don't have to.
If it doesn't, then my job is to cram it down tribes throat how much they suck until they finally use their moderator tools on me exactly in
contradiction to their own pre-stated moderation terms.

Or leave tribe, period.

Leaving tribe period isn't that bad of an idea.

of course, fixing it is a much better idea.

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PANZalt
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i agree, my point exactly.
Today, 11:22 AM
The future is not a result of choices among alternative paths offered by the present, but a place that is created-created first in the mind and will, created next in activity. The future is not some place we are going to, but one we are creating. The paths are not to be found, but made, and the activity of making them, changes both the maker and the destination.

John Schaar
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Vair...
VairoChana:
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Re: i agree, my point exactly.
Today, 11:43 AM
It seems to me that you negate your point and efforts by engaging in a similar or identical MO as those dumbass cliques you're speaking about. I know it's difficult to be heard above the din of dumbasses.

Perhaps the difference is that you appear to care, and they effectively don't, or don't take it in as personal ( and perhaps as obsessive) manner as yourself.
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tribes » Computers & Internet » Tribe.net Brainstorm » topics »
holy spam-floodfest moderator
topic posted Today, 9:42 AM by wildapache


why is this allowed to continue?






posted by:
wildapache
offline wildapache
Colorado
222 friends
reply to this post

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PANZalt
PANZalt
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 9:45 AM
oh please, its always finewhen satan starts three new threads about literally bullshit.

i have a better question for you.

why do you hang out with a bunch of abusive losers who suck down one good tribe of another into trollshit?

And thus, whats your real agenda other than silencing me? as usual?

reply to this post
*
o
PANZalt
PANZalt
online 30
new post
Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 9:47 AM
n order to have it, you have to define it. but rather than define it so that we can then work to obtain it, lets talk about what it isn't.

Free speech is not a pack of TROLLS and their ALTS determining that the geeks can't have a conversation by always trolling them down, trashing their threads, hijacking threads, being abusive, using slander and personal defamation, manipulation and headgames, and everything else to shut you or anybody that might have thought of talking to you up or out.

Free speech is not the same 25 personalities forming a troll clique and then systematically destroying/ consuming one tribe after another
and reveling the glory of their evil super powers.

Free speech is not a brainstorm tribe where bothering to post much beyond a one liner idea puts you in the firing gallery,

and free speech is not an obvious patent sociopath beating people up psychologically who runs how conveniently the management/user interface aspect of tribe.

Free speech is not a cult of asshats, keeping everybody else from communicating, nor is it a cult of control freaks, keeping everybody else
from communicating.

To hear the TROLLZ tell it, free speech means that they should by definition get to say whatever they want and thats that.

They should be able to libel, stalk, harass, defame, abuse, use abusive language, mock, and use logical fallacies and propaganda
to beat you down; not with sense, nor reason, nor as shatter would have us believe with his utterly shallow and insipid imitation of
"compassion."

But with mere noise, nonsense, and mockery.

Thats the troll idea. and most social networks and most twentieth century institutions have bought this, hook line and sinker.

They figure anything else is either too governmental or too complicated, and nobody really knows how to represent a rules based system
that would protect real free speech, let alone implement one in a program, .... so nobody bothers.

Erstwhile, civilization goes to hell in a handbasket as does tribe and most everything else because geeks of the true variety are outnumbered 100 to one by evil bastards, and 1000 to one by pack psychology sleepwalkers.

Pearls and swine, pearls and swine, flushing it all down as we go and its all trod under and gone....
the conversations we pretended to have, while trollz spewed the place with the shit guaranteed to cover over and thus functionally erase any gems.

What then is free speech? free speech is the simple proposition that people should be able to say what they want; AS WELL AS HAVE THE KIND OF CONVERSATION THEY ARE LOOKING FOR. Otherwise, all any of you are doing is going and talking to an empty forest,
and the most of the lot of you thus wouldn't pass a good turing test.

Free speech is not me trying to talk about things and then people attacking me for trying to talk. it is not about shatters egotism or his utter
ignorance or his headgame vampire parasite head trip.

It is not Mr M freaking out and having a cow on my thread and then later admitting that he was there simply to silence me and anybody else
i might try to talk with.

It is not skooter, who, tho his intentions are much better, lives in that environment and who thus has become a bit too gun happy,
spritzing you with bullets that make no sense.

Free speech is when the geeks can have their geek conversations and the trolls can have their conversations.
Not when the trolls can pre-empt any geek conversation, and not when geeks pre-emptively demand that trollz always behave.
To hear the trollz tell it society is in mortal danger from the geeks imposing some sort of fascistic moderation scheme.
This is a total reversal and doublethink and projection. The truth is that these people are actively engaged in social warfare
for ego purposes, and they are thus social parasites who want an easy slaughter of fresh innocents.

The truth is that its the geeks who for the love of god cannot find one damn good intellectual conversation on all of tribe...

or for that matter, one good intellectual.

Free speech is not catering to trollz and letting them drive anybody else away, and it is not listening to the idea of free speech contorted into
a weapon against itself and believing in that as a dogmatic delusion.

Free speech is for the most part nowhere to be found in your civilization. everybody talks but nobody listens. Most people don;t have anything worth listening too anyways, and it forms a circular habit. As parrot chatter affirming the existence of ego and social identity,
thats great. but tribe has a 99th percentile tribe thats obviously been infiltrated by the same old crew of tribe trolls all with IQs under 120.

Its got a tou watchdog tribe that is now renamed tou corndog. I'm sure thats a comic relief.

Everywhere you look on tribe its the same thing. every major conversation space on tribe is shit because there is so little moderation and
so few people left with any intelligence.

One only has to look around a lot more to see interesting differences. Go to some chat zone site where your only allowed a one sentence contribution at once. stay on it for three days straight and then come back and tell me it has any meaning compared to a full conversation
with things like paragraphs.

It works great for children, the socially inept, or people with IQs under 90. For the rest of us, theres too little bandwidth.

TROLLZ and anti free speech are the same thing. its bandwidth control, and it drives everything stupid. This suits trolls fine because the reason why they are the way they are in the first place is that they are only able to think in terms of competition with a population that they
more or less consciously or subconsciously know is composed of their intellectual superiors. All TROLLZ are overcompensators for
their lack of social skills and their lack of intelligence.

And tribe buys it. And tribe expects anybody other than TROLLZ and sheeple to stick around.
"You are free to make your own tribe."?
And do what with it exactly?
Spend thousands of hours competing with troll tribes to lure sheeple back to my tribe?

Participate myself in the scam of it all and actually go find intellectuals to bring as fresh meat to TRIBES
canned troll food factory?
reply to this post
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PANZalt
PANZalt
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Re: holy spam-floodfest moderator
Today, 9:48 AM
so why are you only against free speech when i'm the one talking?

Here are the problems I see and here is how i see fixing them.

Problems;
1. Theres not enough information out there thats good.
2. Obama (or etc Nader, Kucinich, personality X) is just as susceptible to bad information as anybody else is until he gets his own education.
3. Trillions of Dollars are spent and Trillions more are wasted (every year) keeping the population spoonfed propaganda and thus dumbed down.
4. Our problems are too large and too complicated for any one person to solve- Even me, and I have been working on it more sincerely and with more
God given skills for it than any presidential candidate.
5. Washington is full of lobbyists and voices who are all clamoring to be heard. They are selling all of them trash ideas, non solutions, and crap, which gets
them money in the short run by screwing the masses.
6. Each and every single one of our problem areas can be traced back as a whole problem to the intervention and corruption of Corporations.
Our civil rights, The energy problem, the Environment, government ethics, economics, homeland security, etc... each of these issues right now has a core contributing root which is that big money likes these problems because these problems make big money. Immigration, social security meltdown, privatized healthcare, the push to privatize education... The repugnicon method is to divide and conquer and then treat the wounds as eco niches, and move in.
7. The repugnicon method is to divide and conquer, utilizing propaganda and corporate power leveraged against the citizenry. Republicanism is by definition
a parasitic agreement between luxocrats and ignorant and uneducated dupes.
8. Politicians with law degrees are trained to make good arguments. Not solve problems. A law degree is not a degree in Sociology, Civil Engineering, Education Reform, Medicine, Energy Science, Physics, Agriculture, or etc. Lawyers with presidential campaigns don't have the knowledge base required to
solve these complicated problems. Thus; ONLY a SOCIAL MOVEMENT can bring about REAL CHANGE.



Solutions;
1. Build an open source think tank in order to actually work on overcoming the problems.
2. Utilize formal logic, reason, and science fact, to work on a scientific problem solving process.
3. Utilize group intelligence in order to actually create problem solving process and then real solutions.
4. Realize that it actually only takes a very small number people that are truly focused to come up with the real solutions.
5. Understanding this, realize that theoretically, 100 people working 40 hours each could probably solve the problems
better than both or either parties plus ralph Nader Combined.
6. Understand that these solutions, unlike presidential platforms, would be constantly evolving and growing in sophistication
as more people and more information and more ideas were added.
7. realize that bad ideas would thus actually be filtered out.
8. Given that 1-7 are so, what will be required in order to have an informational revolution is 100 persons or so, to do the original work load.
9. Once that is done, an additional 5 hours per participant in order to advertise, plus a 100 dollar investment to advertise in the local newspapers, etc,
will create a viral and geometrically increasing social movement, which will become, rapidly, and unstopable wave form.
10. Understand that when the energy peaks, Thousands or millions of particpants will become involved, and that instead of mob intelligence which
grounds mob thinking in stupid, the new rules of this form of communication will create a situation where mass intelligence brings intelligence into phase
and into harmony, thus creating a group IQ which is dozens of times smarter than any one single participant.
11. This will be the smartest and most powerful think tank ever created; A neurological net combined with the internet to create a new virtual organism;
A collective mind of WE THE PEOPLE.

12. The way to do this rests in the fundamentals of formal conversational logic itself. The rules by which such a group mind must operate are inconvenient
to control freaks, propaganda artists, and so forth, but they are simple rules which formal conversational logic has in fact understood now for centuries.

The Criteria for a Functional Group SuperIntelligence are these;
1. Dynamic and sufficient organization. Threaded conversations, multiple forums, a virtual filing cabinet formed to house any considerable problem solving process.
2. Genuine open democracy and true transparency even in self governance.
3. Conversational Logic is used to determine neutrality and truth value as well as relevance
4. Collaborative and Cooperative mood and atmosphere
5. Open and free space seperated from problem solving process for minority dissent; Internal hosting of splinter or counter movements.
6. Meritocratic Intellectualism
7. Non Violent communication and organization for use as primary tools of "moderation."
8. Participant agreement that all past paradigms are to be mined for their good and shredded for their bad.
This includes republicanism, democratism, socialism, Corporatism, And all other political isms.
9. Participants understand that they are mutually creating new paradigms, but that even a new paradigm is potentially just the next larger mental box;
inoculation against groupthink via familiarization with epistomology, epistomological problems, and symbology psychology.
10. Each participant is tasked to research, compile, read, report, self educate, work a group thought experiment, rinse, repeat.




mytalktoday.com/forum/index.php

in case anybody misses me, thats where i have gone.
I'm an admin/moderator over there. YAY!.

It will serve my purposes much better i think than over here.

:)

Tho i assume i will stop in form time to time for the stuff that won't play well over there.
and to try to dig up more people to come on over...


It is ti me for all true patriots to come together to discuss our problems, their definitions,
realistic problem solving process, and the solutions which together we can find. It is time for us
all to follow each of these golden arrows shot from the Bow of Obama, out to its resting place,
To look at what he is pointing at, and then to begin to build together a possible world inspired by his vision.
Let each of us know that we all have a stake in these problems and their solutions, and we all have
wisdom or knowledge which can be applied to the process. Lets talk about the issues. Lets snatch the dialogue
away from petty manufactured distractions. Lets have an ADULT conversation about politics, for the first time
in history. We must be the change we wish to see.
"Never doubt that a small group of people working against impossible odds can change the world. Its the only thing
that EVER has."
tribes.tribe.net/obamaknig...5d-4de3-b5 53-6c5e8e81850a

Get eight freinds together and try it.
If you practice only a few hours, you should start having at the very
least an awesome choral group. And if you go on for a while,
you should start making transitions into Theta states of consciousness.

This is called Glossolia.
It is a reconstruction based on an intrinsic understanding of several
key principles about how mind works. I won't try to explain why it works,
I will just tell you that it does.
(after you have tried it and want to understand it, come on back to me
once you have the experience that will make my explanation make sense to you.)




The internal dialogue structure of Theta States of consciousness is harmonic-
musical. We know this as people often experience "hearing a chorus of Angels"
when a Theta condition is induced.

Drumbeats at the same cycles per second as a given state are powerful cues
that can help us to enter altered states of consciousness.

The following is a methodology for entering Theta states of consciousness, designed
by yours truly.




prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:28 PM 3 out of 31


Trybl Vortx Part Two, The Prequal.

Drummers Parlance.

In theory, the Trybl Vortx system by itself should work fine.
It is an absolute
description of the variables involved, and a total solution.
In practice,
singing like angels is too hard.
The requisite skill, or understanding involved
is too far removed from human experience.

Thus, we have "Drummers Parlance", Both a pre-quel game, and a description of a
very specific form of communication.
Drummer's parlance is simply the communication verbally of a pattern or
patterns, which can then receive tonal or musical counterparts. Drummers'
parlance in the strictest sense is non-tonal, or rhythm only. Sounds are
representations of various durations of time.

The duration of time covered by a "A" is a .1 amount of time. The duration of a
"Ta" is.2 duration of time. The duration of a "Ka, or a "Te" is also a .2
representation of time. Then a "Toom" is a .3 duration of time. These
definitions can be stretched, but the general idea is there.

Then, those kinds of syllables are arranged to count time in pattern. The
pattern repeats, and that is what gives us a "Full measure" of time.

For instance:


Tecka Tecka Toom Toom Te Ka Toom Ta La Toom Teck Teck Ta Ta

Tecka Toooma Tecka Ta Te Ka Ta Tooma la Teck Toom Teck la

Ta Tecka Ta Toom Ta Ta Ta La Tecka Tecka Ta Tooma Ta Ta Ta

Toooma Toooma Ta Ta Ta Toom Ta Toom Ta La La Ta Tooma Ta La

Elata Ta Lata Eee La Ta Ee Lata Tooma Ala La Ee La Tecka Tecka

Tee Tooma Tee Tooma Ta Ta Tecka Tooma Elata Tao Teck Toom Tecka Tao

Ticka Ticka Tock Tao Ticka Tooma Tock Toom

Tick Tock Tao Tao Ticka Tao Tecka





prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:30 PM 4 out of 31
--- editing note; this was actually cut by the hosting site, and some information is missing
here, but its probably fine without it.---------------------------------------------


This gets us to 29. I am going to go with the idea that you get my point
before
I count to a thousand.
The point is that we have now created 100 "phrases" if we count that high,
which
are one or two beats long. The Lengths of the various beats is variable and
is
the most interesting part of all of this. If we say that it all just goes
from 1
to ten, then Tao-Aum is 13 counts. Rhythms we feel comfortable with are
at their
simplest 3 beats long. The heartbeat is Ta-silence-Doom. More complex rhythms
go
up into the 20 beat range but not much higher. Any set pattern should repeat

within 20 beats or the human mind won't be able to comprehend it.
Tecka Tecka Toom Toom is six beats, and in the time of the second exploration,
4,1,4,1,5,5 counts long. 20 counts. A pattern at 23 beats;
Tecka Tecka Toom Toom Elati Tati Toom Toom Tecka Tecka Elati Tati Toom.

With a count of 4,1,4,1,5,5,2,1,2,2,2,2,5,5,4,1,4,1,1,2,2,5 for sub- total of
10, 10,11,10,10,10. And a total of 61 counts.

So the point of all of this is to get a mental picture of what is possible for
different kinds of rhythm patterns.
The Idea of drummers parlance is that I should be able to say to a drummer,
"Give me: Tecka Tecka Toom Toom, Elati Tati Toom Tao" And have them go, "Give
that to me three times." And I Go "Tecka Tecka Toom Toom, Elati Tati Toom Tao
Tecka Tecka Toom Toom, Elati Tati Toom Tao Tecka Tecka Toom Toom, Elati Tati
Toom Tao Tecka Tecka Toom Toom, Elati Tati Toom Tao" And Then They are doing
it
with me, and it sounds good, because we are both in the same pattern.
Then, I can play my flute inside of the pattern of the drummer, and the next
thing you know, we sound like a rocking duet.

That's only part one of Drummers parlance and it's the most interesting half.
The other half is even more annoying and more like an exercise but it really
works.
This other half is basically as simple as "counting time."

123123123123123123123123123123123
123,123,123,123,123,123,123,123,123
12341234123412341234123412341234
1234,1234,1234,1234,1234,1234,1234,
12345, 12345,12345,
12,1234,123,123,1234,
123,12,123,1234, 12,
And so forth on and on into infinity.

By learning Drummers Parlance, we are learning to think in the kinds of patterns
that we have to use later on in Tick Tock Tao.





prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:31 PM 5 out of 31


The rest becomes a question of what you are trying to express.
The answer is of
course that you are trying to express an emotion,
which is really just a state
of consciousness.
Realizing this, we are looking at 4 states of consciousness,
and realizing that certain tempos,
beats, and tones describe each of these
states. Thus, music can be created specifically to harmonize the individual
into
a given state of consciousness.
(But this hasn't been done as far as I know yet, only frauds have tried it,
people who had no real understanding of states of consciousness, or not
enough
skill.)

Where do we go from here? We start a pattern, and we show how any such
pattern
evolves musically and harmonically,
how slow beats have within them the seeds of
faster beats and how fast beats are tied to slower beats.
Using the eight roles,
any given pattern can become a total song.

The entire process is in a sense best accomplished in a large group of people.
The 4 track is a great tool, but we don't have 20 earphones
and 20 plug-ins for
those earphones for 20 people to participate in recording.
So we get the people
singing first, and then once we are really rocking we make our first sample
recording. Then, if we want to, we take that to the 4 track and add in whatever
we want to. Since we don't have 20 people, the best thing to do is to go with as
many as we can get.
The main thing is that everybody has to do his or her homework.
They have to get
a real sense of what we are doing away from it all.
They have to actually read
the form. Otherwise it's just playing around.
The other thing is we have to have
an understanding that we approach things from a very serious level at first.
Sure it leads into fun, but without focus it disintegrates into noise.
I'd love to be able to hang out for 60 years and play with everybody, but I
can't afford to. What has to happen instead is people have to take responsibly
and seriously the information I am giving them for 30 minutes at a time a few
times a week, and then in a week or two it will be the Angelic Choir.
And then we can release the forms and the structure as just a tool that got us
to the place of being able to play at a more sophisticated level.

Thank you for your time and energy. May peace love and light win within us all.
PrometheusPAN





prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:32 PM 6 out of 31


>TRYBL VORTX (Part One)
Tick Tock Tao
Is a specific form for improvisational singing with a group of people.
Using
this structure, We move from simple to complex, with each individual
adding
another level of complexity. By attuning very specifically to the pattern
as it
all ready exists, we evolve the pattern without loosing each other.
Thus we can
be together as long as we use the structure.

The Idea here is that we have modeled the timing and harmonics relationships
that naturally exist with each other, and come up with "parts" or "roles"
that
reflect these relationships. Then, we model the natural evolutionary path
of a
pattern, as it moves from complexity to simplicity, and we find that in
essence,
these roles have an order to them in terms of who follows who and what
follows
what.

In reality Tick Tock Tao is thus nothing new. It is simply a way of
organizing
things that are well understood all ready. When we look at Tribal
cultures all
over the world (or what is left of them after being effected by the global
hive...) We find that they have very specific formats for social
interaction in
different states of consciousness. Whereas we, the global hive,
have protocols
structure or format for existing in only one state of consciousness.

The words "Tick Tock Tao" are culled from inside of a trance space.
The entire
sequence was at one time used as a trance cue to enter a specific state of
consciousness. The meaning of the words is as follows. Tick refers to time.
Visualize a clock. Music is all about time and timing relationships.
Rhythm is
in a sense just various ways of counting time.
Tock has a double meaning, including Talk. Talking, communicating.
Tick Tock Tao
is a way of learning to communicate musically, rather than a way of creating
entertainment. We try to treat music from the very different perspective of the
shaman. We have two hemispheres in our brain, and one side is verbal while the
other is musical. The fact of our attunement to pitch and the ability of our
voices to sing indicates that at one point in time in human history, we sang to
each other as a form of communication
I have taken this presupposition one step further, and have tried to understand
how music can be used as a genuine shamans tool for facilitating altered states
of consciousness. Specifically, in Theta states of consciousness, Those states
associated with spiritual experience and perception of subtle levels of reality,
we can expect the human animal to have communicated musically, rather than
phonetically. The reason is simple and is about personal experience.
In Deep Theta states, the energy of the electrical impulses in the brain comes
into phase. Millions of signals that in Beta states of consciousness are just
going off in their own way in their own time and their own direction all
suddenly come together "in phase" or in harmony. The hum that is experienced is
audible to the ear, as the electrical output of the brain no longer scatters
itself in patterns of interference but amplifies itself in patterns of sustained
harmony.




prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:33 PM 7 out of 31


Tao refers to the idea that we are indeed changing our state of consciousness
through the use of this exercise. Specifically, we are moving from the yang
waking state to the yin waking state. Thus, the Tao of consciousness is
spinning.


The entire poem:
"Tick Talk Tao" said the Druid to the Drow,
"Be here now and keep your vow to remember.
Do you remember, before you were born?
Leaping through the barley and dancing in the corn?"

"Tick Tock Tao" Said the Faery in the Tree
To the Cave monk sentinel of the cave monk Key
"It's the birds and the bees and the omens I see
That opens the portal of perception to me.

(The poem is an instruction for the ego wall to disintegrate allowing the memory
of pre-mortal existence to come into consciousness.)

Drummers Parlance
Tick, Tock, Ti, Ta, Tia, Ticka, Tocka, Toom, Tooma, are all sounds that are used
in verbal communications of drummers' patterns. This is called "Drummers
Parlance" and is a reality model that was presented to me by a master drummer.
The drumming in the community in which I was operating vastly improved as he
introduced the idea to us.

The Essential Idea
The idea is simple. We can communicate the drum patterns verbally and
phonetically. If we can't do that, we shouldn't be drumming. (At least according
to him.)
The reason is that verbal and phonetic communication proves that understanding
exists about pattern. Otherwise there isn't necessarily and in fact true
understanding. Most drum circles are very chaotic and a-synchronized to the
trained ear.

Instructions
In Tick Tock Tao, there are eight roles. The roles are organized into "Alpha"
and "Beta." Which means "Leader" and "follower." (To some degree. As you will
see, the relationship between Alpha and Beta oftentimes gives the Beta more
freedom and more responsibility too.) The role types are Aummer, Drummer,
Singer, and Whisperer.
These roles represent the natural evolution of pattern. We go from tone, to
rhythm, to song, and out away from order into chaos. Thus, the Aummers start,
and are given time to warm up, then the Drummers Start, and are given time to
warm up, then the singers start, and are given time to warm up, and then the
whisperers start. Nobody is really waiting for them, at least not until level
two.
The Whisperers have a special role. They perform slowly the evolutionary path
of all three other types of roles. When they finish, if the groove is still
going, the Aummers become Whisperers. They get to drum, and then sing, adding
their own parts to the more
>




prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:35 PM 8 out of 31



complex pattern. Once the Aummers have been singing for a while, The drummers
should feel free to sing also.
In this way, the pattern evolves into complexity.
On the other hand, especially while we are learning how to do Tick Tock Tao,
what will often happen is that the pattern will start to break apart. The
Whisperers are the pattern police. If the pattern starts to fly apart, their job
is to make sure that it flies apart completly, blows itself open wide, and thus,
the energy is released.
Even really rocking grooves must eventually come to an end, and it is the
whisperers job to raise the energy out into chaos and celebration. That way a
new groove can start.

I have written role cards to make this very easy. Each person receives a role
card. (If there are more than eight people, buddy up with the person next to
you, unless that person is a singer, in which case, play drummers.)

Tick Tock Tao in the most formal sense does things the hard way by going from
toning to rhythm. It may be easier to start out with a simple pattern of some
kind.



Alpha Aummer
Everything begins with you. You breathe deep and hold a base tone.
For three full breaths, The Beta Aummer matches you. The Beta Aummer Tones the
same tone exactly, and covers you while you breathe. Then The Beta Aummer picks
a new tone, and the two of you take turns. When the drumming starts, you will
begin oscillating between the first tone and the second tone, for the duration
of a full measure. For instance, the drummer will say
"Ticka Ticka tocka teck toom tock
doon" The drummer will do this over and over, and you will tone for the duration
of that pattern a single tone and then another single tone, back and forth. As
things evolve, you can bring in more single tones for the full measure of that
pattern. Eventually, once the singers are really going, you can chop the pattern
into smaller chunks and tone for the duration of those.
Your part may be boring for you, but remember, you are helping everyone else
keep time.
In level two of the game, you will pass your card on and receive a new card, and
a new role. Maintain your old role until you fully understand your new role.
Then switch roles.
Remember to listen to the tone the Beta Aummer gives you, and try to take turns
breathing and toning with them. (Take your breathe on a given beat.)



Beta Aummer.
You will listen to the alpha aummer, and support them by mimicking what they do
exactly at first. However, you will soon begin to take turns breathing, and as
you explore that single first tone that the song is based on, you will choose
personally a second new tone that is 5 or seven or nine or some number that works
well distant from the first tone in terms of whole notes. (Thus forming a sort
of master structure of high note and low note between the two of you.)
You should probably consider range here as the most important factor, the alpha
aummer is going to pick a tone that is comfortable for their voice. You are going
to match that tone exactly, or find a resonance with it an octave below or above.
When you change over to a new tone, you want to be in a place that is comfortable
for your voice.
In the first level of the game, i am sorry to say that your role may be somewhat
dull for you, as you will simply take turns going back and forth with the alpha aummer,
one of you breathing deeply in while the other Aumms.
However, be assured that you are holding the root of the experience together and
that you give the structure the stability it needs. Everybody is listening to the two
of you to keep time by.

Alpha Drummer.
You will pick the primary beat structure for the song. You will chop the two tones
each into several peices, listening to both the alpha and beta aummers. To do this
it may help to closely reveiw the preveiw material for the exercise regarding beat
structures. The two Aummers are going to create a whole phrase going back and forth
between them;
"AUMMMMMMMMMMM, aummmmmmmmmmmmmm"
your response, for instance, might be;
"teka teka ta ta, teka teka tooma"
You want to keep it pretty doable and not very complicated, a sort of slower beat, so that
the beta Aummer can add in a faster version of what you are doing with more syllables.


Beta Drummer.
You will listen to the alpha aummer, and notice that the beat is kind of slow. You may be
pciked for this job because you are found to be really good at drumming. This is
a key role and one thats easy to make a mess of, so it is important to be on it.
You have on the other hand one of the funner roles. You get to chop the longer beat
into several more beats, in the above example,

the aummers are doing a
"AUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM, aummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm"
alpha drummer response, for instance, might be;
"teka teka ta ta, teka teka tooma"
your response might be;
"teketititeka tati tati tekati tekatiti toomata"



prometheuspan
4/19/2001 4:39 PM 10 out of 31


Alpha Singer
You listen to the Alpha Drummer, whose pattern is slower than the beta drummer.
You listen to the tones created by the Aummers. You Mimic the Alpha drummer
until you are sure you have the pattern. Then, you begin to add tones. Your
first tone should be the same as the alpha Aummers, and your last tone should be
the same as the beta Aummer. Next, you fill in that rhythm with tones. You
create a song that becomes the master tonal pattern. If level two is achieved,
your choices become the
Underlying pattern that everyone else follows in the creation of song.
Remember that you are listening to two elements and blending them. You are
listening to the rhythm first, to pick it up, and then to the tones the Aummers
are using, so that it all stays in harmony and key.
Synthesizing these two levels is the hardest job in Tick Tock Tao and one that
it can't work without. If you end up feeling overwhelmed by the task,
Switch roles with somebody else.
The difficulty of this job is made easier in that your song is with the slow
beat, not the fast one. This is very key to your success. Pay attention only to
the Alpha Drummer,
Not the Beta Drummer.


Beta Singer
You listen to the Alpha Singer. They will be singing a slow song. You mimic
their song until you are certain that you have it. You will notice that they are
in beat with the alpha drummer and in tone with the Aummers. Put your attention
next on the Beta Drummer, who is your pal. They are doing a beat that is faster
than the Alpha Drummer. Separating yourself now psychologically from the alphas,
follow the same pattern you have but bring more beats into it and evolve it so
that it is in time with the faster tempo.
This skill is all about taking the singing pattern and adding "flams" and
"perks' to it. If the long pattern is going "Teck Tooma" while the fast pattern
is going "Elata Ladoonta"
Then you are simply adding two syllables. Maybe its "TaTaTa Tooma
Tecka Tooma" for the fast pattern. Now you are essentially multiplying two by
three, three syllables for each of the main two.
Each Of the Alpha singers tones becomes the base note in a chord.
You are filling in the rest of the notes to form a whole chord.

Whisperers
As a Whisperer you mimic the Aummers. This is your chief job, but of all the
jobs, your job changes the most. If the pattern makes it to a full on groove,
with the beta singer completely in for a while, you go ahead and begin to evolve
along the path. Spending time now slowly with each of the other roles, you mimick
each of the others in turn until you arrive back at your own space after the beta singer.
this re-enforces the assorted roles, you act as a sort of back up singer that
helps hold the groove together. Your job over all is actually the role of the
mechanic, if somethings a little off, your job is to attempt to fix it. But if its
unfixable, your job is to scrap it for a new start.
Other than that, you also get the fun job of adding interest. Animal noises,
poetic babble, (actual language engades the verbal mind and should be totally avoided
for the entire exercise) and other such things are the spices you can throw in for
emphasis and variety.
The Alpha whisperer should focus on the alpha roles and the beta whisperer should focus on
the beta roles.




------------------------

This all applies to telepathy rather directly, as the art of MIMICKRY that you have to employ,
of listening to the group, of not letting your ego interere, but rather,
giving over to the true center, these are all the same skills you need for telepathy.

Further, if you attain theta this way, in a social environment, two things will happen.
1. You will be able to hear the angelic choir
2. You will have limited telepathy with the people you are doing it with.

Good luck.
If ANYBODY actually takes me seriously and does it, you could have profound
results in only the next few hours.

I have for myself eight cards, on which I have the eight roles written down.

Thats a great way to go, as then you can switch roles without even talking about it.




DJ43
4/20/2001 11:40 AM 12 out of 31

I take you quite seriously, and I am going to have to print these posts out so that I have them
permanently.
However, it will be days before I can attempt to do the actual process, not a few hours, sorry.
Thank you for so much detail.
One question, just so I am clear, I need to be sure to gather seven people together,
or may it be a number less than eight including myself?
Respectfully,
Denise



Prometheuspan
4/20/2001 9:34 PM 13 out of 31

There are eight roles in the game as described, I think about four is the bare
essential absolute minimum. There is no real maximum,
but you will have to work out organizing it yourself.

You can easilly have two or three people fill each role.
Group them together of course, and make sure they follow each other.

Best of luck!!

And thank you so very much for getting to it at all!!

The real take off for this area will be the results you achieve.
two more weeks for the area and counting...



iammeinabody
4/21/2001 3:30 PM 14 out of 31

Thanks for the info. It clarified some experiances and gives me something to work on.
I'm having a great time trying to keep up on all this.
Now I just need to expand time so to include practice. K



prometheuspan
4/21/2001 3:52 PM 15 out of 31

yes, but does anybody have any questions?

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